It's 2022 and we are back with our bold HR predictions for the year. Will it be another shitshow? Maybe! Nevertheless, we (or at least Tyson) have high expectations for People Operations this year, including the need to focus on mental health, work personas, getting rid of the concept of work hours, and adding in more intentional human experiences. Say goodbye to employee experience and hello to 'employee lifestyle.' 2022 is gonna be lit!
Release Date: January 11, 2022
[00:00:00] Recording: Warning, this podcast is about the realities of working in people operations. This is not a stuck-up PC compliance-based or employment law podcast about stuffy, outdated HR practices. Shit will get real here and we assume no responsibility.
[00:00:17] Speaker: Just another day in the office.
[00:00:18] Alexa Baggio: There's nothing better than like a bunch of people who work in HR getting around a table and sharing these stories. We have this like outer body experience in HR where you're like, "How the fuck did I get here?" It's not that bad.
[00:00:27] Tyson Mckenzie: HR's not that bad. It's not.
[00:00:29] Alexa: Come hang out with Tyson and I on this podcast, we'll make you laugh.
[00:00:32] Recording: This is the People Problems podcast with Alexa Baggio and Tyson Mckenzie.
[00:00:40] Alexa: Happy New Year, Tyson, 2022.
[00:00:43] Tyson: Happy New Year. Oh my God, 2022.
[00:00:46] Alexa: New year, new me. Just kidding. Same old- same old-
[00:00:49] Tyson: New year-
[00:00:50] Alexa: -same old us
[00:00:51] Tyson: -same shit. [laughs]
[00:00:51] Alexa: Same shit, same clusterfuck, just a new episode. It's a new episode of the podcast. First episode-
[00:00:58] Tyson: It's the first episode.
[00:00:59] Alexa: -in the new year. Yes.
[00:00:59] Tyson: Yes, so that's exciting.
[00:01:01] Alexa: If anyone's still listening-
[00:01:03] Tyson: Here we are.
[00:01:03] Alexa: -here we are. We-we made it to 2022.
[00:01:04] Tyson: Is anybody out there?
[00:01:06] Alexa: Yes. Anybody? Anybody at all?
[00:01:09] Tyson: [chuckles]
[00:01:10] Alexa: Um, 2022, yeah, it's-- That's a lot of twos.
[00:01:13] Tyson: Yeah. There's a hilarious meme that it's like 2020 too. [laughs]
[00:01:17] Alexa: Yeah. Like two-point- like version two. Oh, fuck. Like twice.
[00:01:20] Tyson: [unintelligible 00:01:19] two, like 200 or T-O-O.
[00:01:23] Alexa: Yeah.
[00:01:23] Tyson: Wow, I can't.
[00:01:25] Alexa: Yeah, I got it.
[00:01:26] Tyson: I just like made my like letters and numbers all mixed up. Oh my God. Okay, I'm tired. Four months sleep regression happening over here, so.
[00:01:31] Alexa: Yeah, that's all right. I-I trust that you can count in real life. This podcast is not real life, let's be honest. Yeah. How was the holidays? Any-anything big popping in Canada? Do you guys do anything fun?
[00:01:41] Tyson: [sighs]
[00:01:42] Alexa: I mean, probably not, right?
[00:01:43] Tyson: No, like we're still kinda-- [crosstalk]
[00:01:45] Alexa: O-omicron trying to fuck it up for everybody.
[00:01:46] Tyson: Everyone-- Yeah. Look, like it was- it was nice 'cause it was obviously like my baby's first Christmas and she got spoiled-
[00:01:52] Alexa: Aw.
[00:01:52] Tyson: -by her-her grandparents and stuff. So like, that was good but--
[00:01:55] Alexa: What's the best gift that Rosie got?
[00:01:57] Tyson: So it's my gift that I gave her.
[00:01:58] Alexa [laughs]
[00:01:59] Tyson: I got her this, uh-
[00:01:59] Alexa: You're-you're not biased at all.
[00:02:01] Tyson: -from Pottery Barn. It's called the Everywhere Chair or Anywhere Chair, something like that. Anyway, so it's like Sherpa, so it's like fluffy and white, and it's got her name engraved in one. Embroidered in it.
[00:02:10] Alexa: Oh, is it like-like kinda-kinda like grounded-looking?
[00:02:13] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:02:14] Alexa: I know the chair you're talking about.
[00:02:15] Tyson: I feel like everyone's got it.
[00:02:15] Alexa: Yeah.
[00:02:15] Tyson: Yeah. So I-I made her like a playroom basically, like Santa brought her a playroom.
[00:02:20] Alexa: Is it Montessori approved?
[00:02:21] Tyson: It is Montessori approved and it's like-- It's so funny, like I never would've thought-- I-I take the aesthetic of my house very seriously, so like I-I was like, "You know what, I'm gonna have to like embrace this." So I just like went with it and I just built this like adorable little place- playroom and it's all like, you know, beige and white and like my-my color scheme, so.
[00:02:39] Alexa: Nice. Well, we'll have to- we'll have to get a sneak peek of, uh,-
[00:02:42] Tyson: A tour. [laughs]
[00:02:42] Alexa: -Tyson's home office. Yeah. And-and-and the Montessori playroom here on the podcast for our- for our avid listeners and video watchers in the future. Cool. All right.
[00:02:51] Tyson: But you-you had an exciting time off.
[00:02:53] Alexa: I did. I actually did some Instagram stories, which I never do. I'm learning.
[00:02:58] Tyson: Amazing.
[00:02:58] Alexa: I learned how to add little things and do some filters.
[00:03:01] Tyson: Instagram stories are so 2013.
[00:03:03] Alexa: I know. I know.
The whole time I was doing it, I was like-- I was talking to my brother who was on the trip with me, and I'll-I'll tell you about in a second, but I was just saying like-- People kept sending, shooting me messages, they're like, "Oh, it's so nice to see your trip." Like, "Look at you, you little Instagrammer," and I-- Because I never do this stuff. I-I hate social media, but, uh, just to be clear, you do know that I'm just bragging about the fact that I'm on vacation in Italy right now. That's all this is. Like me posting this story, like you might think it's cute, like, "Oh, it's nice to see," but you also know that I'm just shoving it in your face that I'm in fucking Italy snowboarding right now. So I feel a little bit like a dick, but I did get some-some nice messages from people, and it was a ton of photos, absolutely-- [crosstalk]
[00:03:40] Tyson: That's like literally what Instagram is now though, it's just like, "Look at me, you suck, I'm better."
[00:03:43] Alexa: That's what social media is in general. Why would there be-
[00:03:46] Tyson: I know.
[00:03:46] Alexa: -any point posting anything? Other than for purposes like this, uh, HR Shook.
[00:03:50] Tyson: True.
[00:03:50] Alexa: Go, HR Shook.
[00:03:51] Tyson: True.
[00:03:51] Alexa: Which is like to talk about some shit you have something to say about, but yeah, I-I just think I-I struggle with that. Plus, I suck at taking photos. Not taking them, but like-like taking them of people. Like everyone always just looks like a fucking monster in my photos, so.
[00:04:04] Tyson: [laughs]
[00:04:04] Alexa: I always manage to have the iPhone version that's like the worst possible camera for the time. Like it's not a six.
[00:04:11] Tyson: Okay, yeah, yeah.
[00:04:11] Alexa: Like I'm not that person. Like I'm not a dinosaur 'cause I break my phone too regularly, but like, I do not have a 13. I have like a 10, like a XS or something and like it's still got the two cameras, not the three, and now I think there's fucking four of them. And so every time I take a photo, like everyone on the trip has these fucking glamorous like, you know, ridiculous HD photos, and I just have this like shit. So I'm like, "Nah, I throw a filter on it, post it, and no one has to- no one will remember in 24 hours."
[00:04:33] Tyson: Yeah, there's so many filters now, honestly. I had a seven up until a couple of months ago, so.
[00:04:37] Alexa: Damn, good for you.
[00:04:39] Tyson: Yeah. I keep my iPhones for a long time. I have like the new one, but I didn't-- I don't have the newest one, but I-I got one that still has just the two cameras, so I'm just cheap as shit.
[00:04:45] Alexa: Well, mine-mine's currently rocking the-the light saber look. I don't know if you can see that, but, uh, for those of you who cannot see the- see us, there's a solid like--
[00:04:52] Tyson: Oh, cool.
[00:04:53] Alexa: No, it's not cool. It's very disruptive too, trying to read things when there's a giant-- [crosstalk]
[00:04:57] Tyson: Oh, it's like broke.
[00:04:58] Alexa: Yeah, it's broken. I-- [chuckles] [crosstalk]
[00:05:00] Tyson: No, I thought it was like an effect. [laughs]
[00:05:01] Alexa: No, people always think that like, "Oh, that's so cool. How do I get that on my background?"
[00:05:05] Tyson: Cool background.
[00:05:05] Alexa: Like you drop it on your poor concrete floors, that's how you get it.
[00:05:08] Tyson: Yeah, you don't want that.
[00:05:09] Alexa: No.
[00:05:09] Tyson: You don't want that.
[00:05:10] Alexa: Probably once a year, maybe once every two years, I just break something and I gotta go get it replaced. Um, it's not fun. Anyway. New year, new iPhone. That's-that's the rule. I'm gonna go get- I'm gonna go--
[00:05:20] Tyson: That's awesome.
[00:05:20] Alexa: Gonna go get one of the good ones tomorrow-
[00:05:22] Tyson: The fancy one. Nice.
[00:05:22] Alexa: -so I can break that too.
[00:05:25] Tyson: [laughs]
[00:05:25] Alexa: Yeah. Anyway. All right, speaking of breaking things, we're gonna move to pops in the news.
So our article today, good find, Tyson, is a Forbes article called Finland Prime Minister's Aspirational Goal of a Six-Hour, Four-Day Workweek. Will it ever happen? So, general gist here is that this woman, Sanna Marin, I'm assuming that's how you say her name, has basically tried to implement after taking over in Finland as the Prime Minister, is trying to adopt a six-hour a day, four-day a week workweek. So basically, 24 hours a week from 40.
And the idea here is they're doing it largely, they're experimenting largely with government employees. She's trying to create more balance, more sort of a, you know, a goal for how government employees can work. And, you know, I think she's trying to be, again, it says aspirational. I think she's trying to sort of push the envelope and-and be innovative.
The article is interesting because what it does is it talks about what she's doing and why she's doing it, but then it actually goes into other examples of other- either companies, organizations, or countries that have actually done this recently. And so, for example, it talks about Sweden, Finland's next door neighbor did a trial program of a six-hour workday, while still maintaining the compensation levels of an eight-hour workday.
So, the program again was largely for government employees and they basically found out they- that like, yeah, it was all right. Like people didn't mind working fewer hours, it gave them a little more balance, but overall, it was unsustainable because the-- I think it was like a retirement home or something where they did it, couldn't afford to make up the hours for the staff. So like, you're still paying everybody for eight hours but they're working six. Like the-the company itself cannot support that.
So then they give a couple of examples of, I think it's a couple of different companies, one called like Tower Paddle Boards, another one called Digital Enabler. I don't- I don't know these companies, but that they were trying to create a five-hour workday. And what was interesting about these examples is that apparently, these companies, basically, you know, they were trying to articulate like, "Oh, if we just give you more like very concentrated time, like uninterrupted, very concentrated time, you'll be much more productive, right?"
'Cause if you're in the office for eight hours, like maybe 45 minutes of that, you take lunch. Like every coup-- Every once in a while, you take like a little break to fuck off and look at Facebook or, you know, whatever, whatever. So over time, when you're not being a-- You know, you can't be 100% productive all the time, you got-- There's lots of research, you gotta take breaks. The idea is that that would accumulate to like a real concise, like solid five hours. So these CEOs tried to implement that.
And basically, what they found out is like, yeah, that's great. Starts out, everybody fucking loves it, and then by the end of it, people are like, "I can't get all my shit done in five hours, and like, you're not expecting less of me. This is crazy." And so they- it starts out really positive and then totally falls off. And then the last example they give that I actually really like, which is pretty cool. Although they talk about Jack Ma and his 996 rule, which if you're curious about that, Google it, I'm not gonna talk about it, is that Microsoft Japan experimented with a shorter work program called the Work-Life Choice Challenge in 2019, uh, summer of 2019. They gave 2,300 employees the opportunity to, "Choose a variety of flexible work styles according to the circumstances of work and life."
The goal of management was to see if there would be a corresponding increase in productivity and morale when hours were cut down. So it doesn't specify what the options were or if there were- if there were options or it was just like a fucking free-for-all, but it's, you know, they have a similar work culture to the- at least the US. And it says, "The results of the experiment indicated that workers were happier, and there was also a 40% gain in productivity."
So, the article ultimately summarizes that like, there's lots of different shit people are trying. Jury's still out on a lot of this stuff, but largely, if you're a bigger company, it's much easier to do this shit because, you know,-
[00:09:16] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:09:16] Alexa: -if you wanna drop people's hours a little bit, you have the resources to cover that. Versus, if you're a small team, and I can attest to this, like you do not have the luxury of being like, "It's fine, work five hours a day. Don't you dare work a day more- an hour or more, but like, I still need you to do all of this of shit and then some." So it winds up having the opposite effect, kinda burns people out, stresses them out for no reason. So I thought it was fascinating. Good find. What do you think?
[00:09:39] Tyson: Yeah. So, where I work we do Fridays off in the summer.
[00:09:43] Alexa: Nice.
[00:09:43] Tyson: And that's the exact sort of--
[00:09:45] Alexa: Yeah, summer Fridays.
[00:09:46] Tyson: At first, we're like, "Sweet. It's amazing." And yeah, yeah, so it's super common of summer Fridays, but it's amazing. But typically, like we're already putting sort of like a six-day workweek into five days, and now we're doing like six days into four days. Like the work doesn't slow down, so that's a really common complaint that-that-that we're sort of seeing as well, is that like, it's just the burnout factor.
[00:10:04] Alexa: Yeah.
[00:10:04] Tyson: My thing though is like, what I wanna focus on more so is like, how do we prioritize work and make sure that we're doing- working on the right things? So like you said, like, if you're working an eight-hour day, and then like part of that, you're just sort of like fucking off and like doing something that's maybe, you know, whatever, you're kind of taking your sweet time to do something or you're not working on like real good work. Like, I like to sort of like get rid of all that stuff. Or like the meetings, you know, I-I feel like we've talked about this before, like getting rid of useless meetings that don't need to be there and like just time-sucks. So, that is like essential if you're gonna be cutting down the workweek because you can't- you can't just do it all, right? 'Cause-
[00:10:38 Alexa: Yeah.
[00:10:38] Tyson: -at the end of the day, like hours in is, although, I guess-
[00:10:41] Alexa: Mm.
[00:10:42] Tyson: -you can become less effective, but hours in is like productivity, like you can't necessarily be more productive working two hours than you would eight hours, right?
[00:10:50] Alexa: Right.
[00:10:51] Tyson: Like I get it to like an ex-- Like that- like the-the Finland example is pretty intense.
[00:10:54] Alexa: Right.
[00:10:54] Tyson: Like six hours, four days is like, uh, an intense example of this sort of thing, so.
[00:10:59] Alexa: Well, you also have to optimize that time perfectly, right? Which most of our-
[00:11:01] Tyson: Well, that's what I mean.
[00:11:01] Alexa: -shit at.
[00:11:03] Tyson: Which could also then lead to burnout, right? Because then you're like, "I don't have time to just like, you know, zone out for five minutes." [chuckles]
[00:11:10] Alexa: Right, you're just spending your extra time stressing about not getting your other shit done.
[00:11:13] Tyson: Right, right.
[00:11:13] Alexa: Yeah, yeah.
[00:11:14] Tyson: You have to be able to-- Like a certain person, I think, would excel in that, but not everyone. So I do like the idea of like Microsoft, like being able to pick what works for you also. Like that just goes into general flexibility, like people need schedules that work for their lives, depending on what they're doing.
[00:11:28] Alexa: I could not agree more with that. I don't wanna spoil one of my predictions but yeah, I-I-- It's-it's related, so I'm not gonna chime in too much here but yeah, I think, uh-- I also just thought it was a cool article that they were like, yeah, people are trying this stuff and like-like--
[00:11:40] Tyson: Love it.
[00:11:40] Alexa: What I love is people fucking trying it, you know, because--
[00:11:43] Tyson: Isn't she like a 34-year-old woman as well?
[00:11:46] Alexa: Yeah, she's--
[00:11:46] Tyson: The Finland Prime Minister?
[00:11:47] Alexa: Yeah, she's a babe. I don't know. It does not disclose her age, but she does not look, uh, lick over 40, I'll tell you that.
[00:11:54] Tyson: Yeah, I thin-I think she's in her 30s.
[00:11:55] Alexa: Although, maybe it's the Finish diet. I don't know, who knows.
[00:11:59] Tyson: I can't wait for like us young people to start taking over like, God, it's gonna be such a-- [crosstalk]
[00:12:03] Alexa: God bless you for saying we're young, I'll take that.
I, uh, I recently got asked to do this profile for a four- this like weird like 40 under 40 thing, and I was like, "Man, I'm-I'm in the 40 under 40 category? Like fuck. I never-
[00:12:18] Tyson: Well, you know what--?
[00:12:18] Alexa: -I never got a 30 under 30, but that ship has sailed, I guess. I guess I'm almost 40, even though I'm not. I'm 34 but like, yikes.
[00:12:26] Tyson: So that-that ship is sailing. I actually turned 30 in 2022, so-
[00:12:29] Alexa: Oh.
[00:12:30] Tyson: -it's a- it's a big year. [laughs]
[00:12:31] Alexa: All right, well, welcome-welcome--
[00:12:32] Tyson: It's a big year. [laughs]
[00:12:32] Alexa: Welcome to the big leagues, kid. Welcome-welcome to the rest of us, yeah. The big 3-0, um. Yeah, all right, anyway, should we move on to some predictions?
[00:12:42] Tyson: Yeah, let's do it, 2022 HR prediction, or like people ops predictions.
[00:12:44] Alexa: All right 2022 predictions for this industry. We're gonna do three each?
[00:12:49] Tyson: Yes.
[00:12:49] Alexa: All right, I'm gonna let you go first. Drumroll.
[00:12:51] Tyson: Okay.
[00:12:52] Alexa: Tyson's number one.
[00:12:53] Tyson: So again, so we've kind of talked about this a little bit like offline, but like mine are less of like predictions and more so like warnings. Like these are the things we need to focus on. So first and foremost, this is not gonna be a surprise, it's nothing groundbreaking, but, uh, it's gonna be mental health.
[00:13:09] Alexa: Oh.
[00:13:09] Tyson: So I think that we are in a really, really tough position as it relates to the stuff that's going on in the world. And I know where I am currently located in Ontario, we've just gone back into a pretty severe lockdown, and I don't think that people are going to be able to handle this for the third time.
[00:13:27] Alexa: We're better than Canada on this one, I'm just gonna say it. [laughs]
[00:13:31] Tyson: It's-it's-it's bad.
[00:13:33] Alexa: The US wins here.
[00:13:33] Tyson: Fin-finally, people-- Yeah, honestly. Like people are starting to speak up, like the kids-
[00:13:38] Alexa: Good.
[00:13:38] Tyson: -are out of school.
[00:13:40] Alexa: Yeah.
[00:13:40] Tyson: Like it's-it's a full-blown lockdown and like we need to really say something to our government because like it's just not sustainable anymore and people can't take it. And we're gonna see a lot more mental health issues with children and obviously with people who are home, not able to see people, so specifically-
[00:13:54] Alexa: Yeah.
[00:13:53] Tyson: -people, like we look-- Like the women, for example, who some of them are leaving work because they have to do childcare and like all this sort of thing. So-
[00:14:01] Alexa: Yep.
[00:14:02] Tyson: -going back, like we need more than just like, "Oh yeah, like the EAP and-and we have an EAP," so that just automatically makes-- You know, that ticks the box for mental health, but for me, it's more about like, how do we create policies that support mental health? So, you know, we talked a little bit about flexibility and work hours, time off, better child care, elder care, how do we--? Maybe like honestly, we get to the point where we can like expense some sort of tutors that can like help with the-the education 'cause the-the kids-- It's so hard to work and like think that your five-year-old can sit on the iPad and do e-learning, like it's just not sustainable. We don't know how long it's gonna last but--
[00:14:36] Alexa: One of the-- That's one of-
[00:14:37] Tyson: -and then obviously--
[00:14:37] Alexa: -the things I think is super interesting about like the "great recession" or sorry, great resignation, which I know we've talked about. We need to do-- You know what we need to start this year off with after this episode? We need to do another buzzword 'cause that one fucking kills me.
[00:14:48] Tyson: Yes, yes.
[00:14:50] Alexa: But part of the great resignation, I mean, some people are talking about this, although I think it's probably like tertiary to like everyone talking about like, "Oh, it's about flexibility and people are reevaluating their lives." It's like, people are also evaluating their fucking mental health and they're just going like, "I can and cannot live with certain-
[00:15:02] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:15:03] Alexa: -versions of this, yeah.
[00:15:05] Tyson: Yeah, so-so mental health is-is huge, even like little things, like can benefits be like home services?
[00:15:12] Alexa: Right.
[00:15:12] Tyson: So like, can we somehow create a benefit to have like a masseuse come to someone's house-
[00:15:16] Alexa: Yeah, girl.
[00:15:16] Tyson: -and give them a massage or something. You know what I mean? Like little things like that like--
[00:15:19] Alexa: We-we do that-- We showcase that stuff in person all the time. All that stuff exists. You want to do it for your place,-
[00:15:22] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:15:22] Alexa: -it exists. Come to me, I'll tell you. [chuckles]
[00:15:24] Tyson: Exactly, so like just being like super intentional, and then obviously, like how do we get people to use them? Because like I, you know, have a slew of benefits, but I can't go out and-and-and use them because like, maybe people are fearful to go out or, you know, the thing that they want to do is closed.
[00:15:38] Alexa: Right.
[00:15:38] Tyson: Like, they-they can't get personal care services. So, thinking about that. Having the right benefits, I know that just seems like, you know, HR 101, but then, how do we get people to use them? Ingraining things into your policies to support mental health, not just like, "Yeah, we like celebrate mental health on like Bell Let's Talk day," or whatever, and then just it-it goes under the rug so--
[00:15:57] Alexa: What the fuck is that?
[00:15:59] Tyson: [chuckles] It's a- it's a Canadian thing, I guess, so Bell, which is like where we get like our internet from, and it's kind of like, I guess like--
[00:16:04] Alexa: Like the telephone company? Like the Bell?
[00:16:06] Tyson: Yeah, that.
[00:16:07] Alexa: Okay, all right.
[00:16:07] Tyson: Bell, yeah. So they have a day in January, I think it's coming up, it's called Bell Let's Talk. And like every time, you like use the hashtag or like do a post on social media, they donate money.
[00:16:17] Alexa: Mm, cool.
[00:16:17] Tyson: It's like a huge mental health day, so let's--
[00:16:20] Alexa: Yeah.
[00:16:21] Tyson: Yeah, let's-
[00:16:21] Alexa: Maybe people will actually start using their fucking EAPs.
[00:16:21] Tyson: -just make mental health every day.
[00:16:24] Alexa: [chuckles]
[00:16:25] Tyson: Use the EAP, seriously, even as an HR person, sometimes when I'm like, "I don't know what the fuck I'm supposed to do in this situation," I call my EAP.
[00:16:33] Alexa: Yeah.
[00:16:34] Tyson: Like, 'cause some situations are-are--
[00:16:35] Alexa: As if you're one of the only fucking people in the world that does that, but yeah.
[00:16:38] Tyson: Yeah, but some situations are dark, you know, that I am not trained in how to respond, you know. I-I struggle with that sometimes, like I'm not sitting here as like a psychologist or something. I don't know- I don't know what to say, so I will call the EAP, and I'll also tell my managers to call the EAP. So, a good example is, if someone, you know, start- was talking about suicide or something, the manager can call the EAP on how they should be responding, because none of us are really trained for that.
[00:17:04] Alexa: Yeah, yeah.
[00:17:04] Tyson: So it's a really good resource.
[00:17:06] Alexa: Yeah, all right, mental health.
[00:17:07] Tyson: So mental health, first and foremost.
[00:17:09] Alexa: Alright, mine-mine are actually more a little bit predictions but-
[00:17:12] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:17:12] Alexa: -also, obviously, I'll weave my opinion in here, because that's all I fucking do. So I'll go with the-- Well, I'll go with what-what was actually gonna be my number two, but there's- these are in no particular order, but now that we've-
[00:17:22] Tyson: Yeah, mine neither.
[00:17:22] Alexa: -sort of touched on it, which is that, I actually think the concept of hours, unless you are paid hourly is going to completely disappear.
[00:17:29] Tyson: Ooh.
[00:17:30] Alexa: I think it is a useless fucking metric at this point. I think it is an input that does not determine an output. I think we've been way too focused on it for way too long, and I think it's literally impossible to put the cat back in the bag on this one. And people have been flexible. I have people on my team that work all different styles, all different hours from all different locations. I trust that they're gonna fucking figure it out. Some of them work late, some of them work early, some of them have kids, they go back to work, some do- some don't, some-- Like it totally depends. What I give a shit about is that they're-they're hitting their goals and they're doing what we agreed to do together on the timelines we talked about, right?
[00:18:04] Tyson: Yeah, of course, yeah.
[00:18:05] Alexa: Why the fuck I would care if you work 10:00 to 6:00, or 9:00 to 5:00, or 9:00 to 9:00 with a four-hour break in the middle? Why do I give a fuck? Like I just-- The whole concept of talking about it is just gonna, I think, drop from the zeitgeist because I think people are gonna realize it's futile. It's a stupid fucking conversation. I think it will come on the back of everyone continuing to try to force people to go all the way back to the office and it failing. I think there's gonna be a big movement around like, everyone's gonna go, everyone's gonna go and the answer is gonna be like, you're gonna have to offer some kind of flexibility.
Unless there is a reason that you have to be hourly, like you're a- you're a lab tech, or, you know, there's some reason you physically have to be somewhere on a regular basis where you're paid, you're compensated hourly-
[00:18:51] Tyson: Mm-hmm.
[00:18:52] Alexa: -why the fuck are we still talking about this? I think it's stupid, I think it will disappear, um, and I think everyone will stop trying to force hours on people, and we will get used to talking about the personas of workstyle, right? So hey, I'm, uh, you know, I'm an on and off, you know, but kind of always on person. You know, I'll take breaks in the middle of the day if it fits my schedule, but like, when I'm on, I'm on. And, you know, I, you know, at the end of the day, when my calendar doesn't have anything on it, like I truly try to turn off, right? Like, I'm just making that up, but people will learn each other styles, and I think what will de-
[00:19:23] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:19:23] Alexa: -what will develop is a few personas of how people work in these environments and just like the way we talked about personality types, right?
[00:19:30] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:19:30] Alexa: I think we'll-we'll start to develop things around those personas instead of being like, "Oh, we got to get everybody to work the same fucking hours." I think it's so stupid.
[00:19:37] Tyson: Yeah, I love that take on it too, 'cause so often, I hear like junior staff complain about getting emails from senior staff at like off-hours. So like, if it's like late at night or on the weekend, and they're like, "Oh, like, how are you expecting us to have work-life balance when you're sending emails at 2:30 in the morning?" And I'm like, "Hold on--"
[00:19:57] Alexa: Why the fuck are you checking your email at 2:30 in the morning?
[00:19:58] Tyson: "Hold on a second." Yeah, you need to set that boundary for yourself, right? Because that might have been the most convenient time for that person to respond. Maybe like-- So I'm thinking about when I go back to work with the baby, so I might have to go, you know, whip out get her at daycare, put dinner on the table, all that bullshit, and then-- I love how I call this, like all this domestic stuff is just not for me. Um--
[00:20:16] Alexa: Sound like such a homemaker.
[00:20:17] Tyson: And then walk back in. Oh my God, I'm like the opposite of that. So anyway, so-- And then, it might be convenient for me to log back on at 8:00 PM, and I personally would benefit from that flexibility. And I think like, you know, that sort of thing. So I like the idea of looking at it as like personas and learning what people's response styles are or like whatever, and setting your own boundaries.
[00:20:34] Alexa: Yeah, I love that. I think people are really bad at setting boundaries actually.
[00:20:38] Tyson: Mm-hmm.
[00:20:38] Alexa: I've been listening to a lot of Esther Perel recently, and she talks about boundaries a lot.
[00:20:41] Tyson: Mm-hmm.
[00:20:41] Alexa: And I think people are pretty shitty at setting boundaries. And yeah, I think like you-- Like, I-I email on late-late at night and on Sundays all the time. And the first thing I tell my team when they come to work for me is, I work on those times 'cause it's really good time for me to get shit done. I'm not on the phone. I'm not managing you guys. Like it's my unadulterated get shit done time. You wanna turn your Slack notifications off after a certain hour, go nuts. I don't care. If it's really urgent, I will really bug you. Like I will call you,-
[00:21:06] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:21:06] Alexa: -I will text. If it's some reason-- And I will not do that. So if you get a Slack message from me on Sunday, I- it's gonna start with ignore until Monday. I am no trying to blow you up."
[00:21:13] Tyson: Right. Well, that's good. That's a good boundary.
[00:21:15] Alexa: Or I'll schedule- I'll schedule it for Monday morning, even though I wrote it on Sunday. You know, you just have to communicate that stuff, but yeah, I think healthy boundaries or at least boundaries that work for other people is a big part of this conversation, so.
[00:21:26] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:21:27] Alexa: I love that.
[00:21:28] Tyson: For sure.
[00:21:28] Alexa: So that's my--
[00:21:28] Tyson: Cool.
[00:21:28] Alexa: That's my first prediction, is like ours is gonna be a dying category. Dying-dying word by the end of 2022.
[00:21:34] Tyson: Awesome. I hope so. I hope so.
[00:21:35] Alexa: All right, number two, you're up.
[00:21:36] Tyson: Okay. So, um, this prediction is that companies will need to focus more on employer brand-
[00:21:42] Alexa: Ooh.
[00:21:43] Tyson: -and not just externally, but internally as well.
[00:21:45] Alexa: Speaking my language, baby girl.
[00:21:47] Tyson: So, we talked for the great resignation, I think the focus on employer branding is going to be on boomerangs. So I love, love, love boomerangs and celebrating boomerang employees. So if you don't know what that is, it's basically-basically when someone leaves, they quit, they go off, they try something else, but then we- they wanna come back, and we welcome them, and there's no bad blood. And you celebrate the fact that that person went, the grass was not greener, and now they've come back. So celebrating boomerangs is huge.
I also think we're gonna see more social media, like this is like a day in the life of, like, I don't do TikTok, but I imagine this stuff will be on like TikTok, LinkedIn, all these things, like, "This is what my day looks like working at X."
[00:22:28] Alexa: I think that stuff's already-already happening a lot, for sure.
[00:22:30] Tyson: It's already happening, but I think we're gonna need to do more of it.
[00:22:32] Alexa: Yeah.
[00:22:33] Tyson: So obviously, with the great resignation, and I-I use the word globalization, but I feel like now that we're like pretty much virtual, like we've become more competitive because of that. That's what I'm like referring to when I say globalization. So you're not just competing with companies, especially in the tech world, because like those fuckers are crazy right now. Like they're like, "Yeah, we're gonna pay San Francisco salaries to everybody across the world, 'cause we're all like remote now." I think with this also the employer brands are going back to like a day in the life. I'm interested to see if maybe something comes in virtual reality from that respect, like seeing more-- I don't know anything about the metaverse, and I'm really trying to avoid that-
[00:23:09] Alexa: Yeah.
[00:23:09] Tyson: -like my life is depending on it, but something along those lines. I think virtual reality is gonna come in. Also, more notice of the corporate social responsibility. I know like we've kind of been like talking about this a lot with like millennials, like actually wanna work somewhere they care about, but I think with a lot of like the social issues that have happened in the world as of late and the Gen Zs coming into the workspace, I think that that's gonna be huge for employer brand, is like actually the delivering on their-their corporate social responsibility.
[00:23:38] Alexa: I love that.
[00:23:39] Tyson: And then, the other sort of like branding thing that I-I-I want to see internally is like career jungle gyms. So like how can you take swings in various places like inside a company? Like, if you wanna-- If I'm in HR and all of a sudden I'm like, "Hey, I'd love-- I'm interested in finance and I'd love a finance role. How can I do that internally?"
[00:23:57] Alexa: I love that.
[00:23:58] Tyson: And again, like, advertising more of that and like, showcasing that within the company.
[00:24:03] Alexa: I love that. Given that I run a business called Showcase, I'm on board. I need to say no more.
[00:24:07] Tyson: [chuckles]
[00:24:08] Alexa: Uh, yeah, I think-I think-- I mean, we've [unintelligible 00:24:09] about this before, so I literally won't chime in-
[00:24:11] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:24:11] Alexa: -like I just full-- Like, yes. [chuckles] Full stop. Yes. Love it. Yeah, I think-I think-I think that's the way the world is going. Um, same thing. I just think you can't put the cat back in the bag on this stuff. Like, people wanna talk about it, people do it all day. There's lots of platforms for them to talk about it. You gotta like step up to the plate. Cool. All right, so my second prediction for 2022 is a little bit of a weird one. I'll see if I can articulate it in my half caffeinated state. My second prediction here is what I'm going to coin micro offices, but-
[00:24:41] Tyson: okay.
[00:24:42] Alexa: -I'm not sure I actually literally mean micro offices, so I'll-I'll tell you where this is coming from. So-so obviously we've talked before in this podcast that I believe that the office is now going to be a much more deliberate space, right? I don't think it's gonna disappear. I still think people need to get together face-to-face. I, you know, host in-person face-to-face events all the time. I-- There's nothing that compares to them.
And in events, you know, a lot of the world is talking about going forward this idea of micro events. So this idea of just like smaller, more curated, more boutique, sort of like higher touch, you know, more quality, less quantity kind of thing, which I get. I mean that's, you know, everyone was talking about hybrid for a year and a half, and then everyone was like, "What the fuck--? Everyone went to an in-person event was like, "What the fuck does hybrid mean?" So we dropped that, and now, they're talking about micro events.
I think micro offices is an interesting concept, because yes, I believe on one side of the spectrum that the office is going to have to be a more deliberate experience. You're going to have to ex- design an experience and a reason for people to come. Whether it's the reason they go to the office, or the things that they can get there, or how it supports their lifestyle. Gonna have to be more deliberate about what the office actually is as an experience.
[00:25:45] Tyson: Mm-hmm.
[00:25:45] Alexa: In addition, when you keep a bunch of your employees remote or hybrid or flexible, I think they're probably gonna be flexible for the most part, that population is going to interact in a different way. So that population is going to be three or four people who, you know, sprinkled in Nevada who all work at the same company, eventually wind up working at the same WeWork, right? Or eventually-
[00:26:11] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:26:12] Alexa: -you know, these guys decide like, "Hey, you know, I've worked for you for two years. You live in Dallas, Texas, I'm gonna fly to Texas, and I'm gonna spend some time working there because I've worked for you for two years, I wanna meet you. I wanna get to know you," whatever. So I think you're gonna see all this sort of like little informal connections start to happen between people that are gonna create these kind of like micro hubs.
[00:26:32] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:26:33] Alexa: And these little micro off-- I'm calling it a micro office, but like these little tiny pieces of culture that kind of exist outside of what we think of as office and company culture, that are actually I think it'll be very vibrant for a while and very interesting places to explore. Like, what happens when you just get couple people together in the same- like in Nashville, because they'll happen to pick Nashville to remote work, and they're on different teams, and they create this little sort of sub-- It's like a subculture, I think, is what I'm going for is the right word.
And I think it's gonna be fucking fascinating. And I think it's gonna be really cool, 'cause I think it's gonna teach us a lot of shit about how we work together, the ways that we connect with people. And I think it's gonna push forward the way that we think about how teams and culture gets created, um, in a way that I think will be a good blueprint for others going forward. I don't- I don't know what will come of it, but I-I think these like little micro subculture offices are gonna be pretty-pretty important.
[00:27:21] Tyson: Yeah. No, that's-- So that's-- I'm kind of like smiling, because it kind of leads into my-my third prediction.
[00:27:27] Alexa: Oh, take it away.
[00:27:28] Tyson: Which is basically just like HR-- Like the old HR is dead and like what we need to do now is like focusing on the human experience, which is exactly what you just explained. That was like an-an example of like what the human experience could be. Like, we've talked about this so many times, like we're-we're no longer just like going to an office to sit at a desk to do heads down work, like that's stupid, right?
[00:27:48] Alexa: right.
[00:27:48] Tyson: Like that's not-- But how can we focus more on like psychology, and like the way that people behave, and like, what creates the most innovative and creative space? Like, it's no longer about just like-- So like, let's say, strategic HR is setting up like people practices to execute business outcomes. Okay, cool, but take that to the next level, which is like, how are we setting up an environment for people to do like human work.
[00:28:17] Alexa: Right.
[00:28:17] Tyson: No longer are we just like computers. Like we've got computers that can do all that other like automated work for us, but like how do we elevate the human work? So let's think like empathy-- [crosstalk]
[00:28:26] Tyson: Right, which is the stuff that people like doing that they--
[00:28:29] Alexa: The people-- [crosstalk] Exactly what people want to do-
[00:28:32] Alexa: Right.
[00:28:32] Tyson: -or what are people are engaged in doing? So we're not just like doing all these like shitty automated things. So it's the automation of that mundane work. And I know we like, we're all waiting, [chuckles] in the HR world especially, we're waiting for that, but-- So automating those tasks. And then, what I wanna see for like the future of HR is just like us to focus on like that human experience. So like identifying and prior-prioritizing the people needs and wants in order to achieve the business objectives. Like specifically, like some of those more like people things.
[00:29:06] Alexa: Right.
[00:29:06] Tyson: Less about like counting widgets. We're over that. I'd love to see more tech--
[00:29:10] Alexa: Yeah, I love that you want in 2022 what we want for this entire industry in general, like-
[00:29:15] Tyson: [laughs] [crosstalk] But its--
[00:29:16] Alexa: -just 365 days, go.
[00:29:18] Tyson: Let's do it. Which I'm not even like working for, so it's so sad.
[00:29:22] Alexa: [chuckles]
[00:29:23] Tyson: But anyways, yeah. So use tech to make things more efficient to-to leave space for people to do the challenging problems, and the work that like a human needs to work on.
[00:29:30] Alexa: I mean, look, I think that's what we talk about all the time is like the-the real elevation and future of this industry is like, when you-- Let's say, you have a group of humans, like we-we talked one-one time about an example of like a- like a call center, and we were like, "Yeah, of course those people are fucking miserable." Oh, I think we were talking about Amazon fucking up everybody's pay, 'cause they had too many- too many things going on.
[00:29:46] Tyson: Right.
[00:29:46] Alexa: Like 60-person team to just like approve leaves.
[00:29:48] Tyson: Right.
[00:29:49] Alexa: I was like, "Ugh." Uh--
[00:29:50] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:29:51] Alexa: Why-why? Why has this been created? What is this terrible anomaly?
[00:29:54] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:29:55] Alexa: Shut this down, but-but if you were to say, "Okay, I'm gonna put a people ops person in charge of this problem because this--" So the business outcome that was created by not paying attention to the way that we built this team was that we hacked together a bunch of technology because no one was making like good, creative decisions, and the people doing the like leave approvals are clearly, I would venture to guess, I don't work there, but I'm gonna venture to guess, they were not empowered to be like, "I think there's a better way to do this. I have a creative solution."
[00:30:23] Tyson: Right.
[00:30:24] Alexa: Right? They're just in there clocking in, clocking out, literally talking about hours.
[00:30:27] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:30:28] Alexa: And so I think, you know, if you can empower those people to say, "Hey, I put a people ops person on this problem for a couple months, a quarter, whatever, and their job was actually to optimize that team's per anticipation in solving its own problems." Holy fucking shit. Would that be a game changer, right?
[00:30:47] Tyson: Right.
[00:30:48] Alexa: Like you just, you sic your people, ops people on the team to be like, "I'm gonna go- I'm gonna go get the ship to write itself. Like watch me work." You know, you're just like, you're like the Ray Donovan of shitty prior decisions. Uh, I think that would be gangster. I think that's what-- You know, but I think that's what you and I do this for, it's like, that's what we want for this industry. But I don't know that it's all gonna happen in 2022, but I love your optimism.
[00:31:09] Tyson: The reason I put this down for 2022 is 'cause I do feel like in a way, and I don't know how to articulate this, but I feel like the pandemic has somehow expedited the need to do intentional work. And I don't know why, but I just feel like it has. I don't know if it's 'cause we're remote. I don't know if it's because this like whole great resignation thing and people are like reevaluating what they're doing with their lives or whatever, but I just--
[00:31:31] Alexa: Ah, it just-- There's no hiding. There's no like--
[00:31:33] Tyson: Yeah, I just feel like it's--
[00:31:33] Alexa: Its been- it's been two years of like, is this deliberate or is this bullshit, right?
[00:31:38] Tyson: Right.
[00:31:38] Alexa: And so the whole world has just been called bullshit on for two years.
[00:31:41] Tyson: Then, that's exactly-- So I feel like coming out of this pandemic, it's just, it's-- We've talked about it forever, but like I feel like, if you just- if you don't focus on people, now is the time that people are actually gonna be like, "I'm getting the hell out." They're almost like empowered to be able to-- I don't know. I don't know.
[00:31:55] Alexa: Yep, yeah, I get it. Look, I mean people leave and make decisions all the time. I think the reality is like, yeah, I don't- I don't know. I just, I can't agree with you anymore.
[00:32:03] Tyson: Like some light has been shown on this. I don't know what it is, but there's something different. I'm feeling like a different vibe in the world now. [laughs]
[00:32:09] Alexa: Yeah. Look, I mean, I like to say we were in the right place at the right time, Tyson, um,-
[00:32:14] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:32:15] Alexa: -that, that we were ahead of the curve here, but yeah, I think the whole world just called-
[00:32:17] Tyson: Totally.
[00:32:17] Alexa: -bullshit on for two years, and it's like, "Oh." Like before, when I could cover my life up with like other social things, and I could be a in the office, and I can have this particular identity, it's like, "Well, you just stripped me of that. I tried to reinvent myself or-or tried to make this work in the existing environment, and you guys were shitty about it, so I'm out.
[00:32:33] Tyson: Right. And I feel like we've just- we've-we've collectively, as the world, gone through a trauma.
[00:32:39] Alexa: Yeah.
[00:32:39] Tyson: Like the whole world-
[00:32:40] Alexa: Oh, yeah. I'm fucking traumatized. [chuckles]
[00:32:41] Tyson: -have gone through trauma. Like i-it's, and everybody has gone through it at the same time, and it's just, there's something about that, that I think that like collective experience is changing. Just the- just changing what people's expectations are from a people perspective-- [crosstalk]
[00:32:55] Alexa: Yeah. I'm a little sad that we've bastardized the term employee experience already in this industry. There's just this industry just picks shit up and spits it out so fucking fast.
[00:33:04] Tyson: No, human experience. I'm using the human experience.
[00:33:06] Alexa: I'm going with employee lifestyle. That's my- that's my--
[00:33:09] Tyson: Okay.
[00:33:09] Alexa: That's my banner for-- Although, I haven't done my number three, that is my banner for 2022. Is like if I had to make one prediction, it would be that the focus is gonna be on employee lifestyle. Full stop. That includes branding, that includes stop talking about hours, that includes like benefits and-
[00:33:22] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:33:23] Alexa: -branding and all the things we've talked about in this conversation. But that's my- that's probably my banner prediction is like, we're gonna shift-
[00:33:27] Tyson: Love that.
[00:33:27] Alexa: -from employee experience 'cause we've already ruined that phrase, to just too many fucking people using it, but-
[00:33:33] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:33:33] Alexa: -to like the lifestyle. Like, what do you fucking afford me as an employee that's gonna make me sit in front of a screen all day for you? Sweet. All right, I'll do my third one real quick and I'll wrap it up. My third one very quickly goes along the same idea here, is that I think we are going to see the rise of-- What I put on my notes was hybrid employee type. And what I mean by that's not what I just talked about. Like I don't- I don't mean that we're gonna see this like- like these different personas of-of a kind of worker. I think what we're at actually going to see is a gray zone between gig part time and full time that expands the options on that array.
So, I think, especially like for example, with women in the workplace, like I think you are going to see a kind of like part-time person who looks and feels a lot like a full-time member. I think you're gonna see-
[00:34:23] Tyson: Mm-hmm.
[00:34:24] Alexa: -what they're-- I think I just saw someone call this, uh, car-career polygamist, uh, which I think is a way of saying like, you're not exactly a gig worker,
you just actually have multiple jobs because you-you like different things or, you know, you're part time here and so you've got some extra time here, or you've got a full-time job and you've got your side gig, whatever.
Um, I think we're gonna see the rise of these sort of ty-types of workers that fit between just like part time and full time. And there's more flexibility, there's more characteristics to them in the way that you can attract them. Um, because tru-truthfully, I think that's the way people are going to get competitive in the labor market, is they're going to say, "Hey, you know, you're part time but you're salaried, and we give you 80% of the benefits of a full-time employee." Or, "Your, you know- your--" You know, whatever. 'Cause I-I feel like those lines are still fairly hard from like a labor-management perspective and the-the way that people and companies manage labor, mostly 'cause they're dictated by state laws, like
what is and isn't part time and all those things.
But I think-I think we're gonna see a world, and that's actually where hours may still exist is like, you know, the-the only way we can manage you is hourly, but again, that would be an hourly situation. It's like, I think you're gonna see the rise of what is not exactly- what is not exactly part time, not exactly full time, not exactly gig worker because companies are finding a way to sort of adjust for different lifestyle needs, different, you know, career trajectories, different goals, different care taking responsibilities, et cetera.
[00:35:53] Tyson: I come from a company that actually did that really well. It was- it was consulting, but basically like there was an option-- Like you had options for what your hours could be, so you could be like 22 and a half, 32, 35 and a half, like whatever. There was like brackets of hours that you could work, and you had to work at least a minimum to get benefits,-
[00:36:12] Alexa: Yeah.
[00:36:12] Tyson: -but you were treated like a salary employee basically.
[00:36:14] Alexa: Right, yeah.
[00:36:15] Tyson: So like your salary was obvious-obviously prorated for the amount of hours, but it works well in consulting because you can charge the hours out very specifically if that's harder in like environments that are like salaried, so to speak. But no, I-I love that as well. And like the other thing, not to keep like talking to the pandemic here, but I think in this time, a lot of people either started side hustles, or grew their side hustle, or something 'cause we didn't have quite frankly anything else to do.
[00:36:41] Alexa: Right.
[00:36:42] Tyson: Um, so I know tons of people that have started businesses like on top of their day job kind of thing. So I think companies that have- give people the space to do that and, you know, celebrate that people do that on the side, um, is-is amazing.
[00:36:53] Alexa: Yeah. I think-I think companies are just gonna have to get more creative with this shit. There's only so many levers you can pull. And I think between benefits and hours and options and flexibility and blah-blah, I think companies are just gonna have to start to test a lot of this shit.
[00:37:05] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:37:06] Alexa: And I think-I think by the end of 2022, we'll-we'll get some-some people that are like, "Hey, this big company has tried this big, innovative thing where--" You know, whether it's 30 hours a week or it's, you know-you know, we're- you're three weeks a month or whatever. Like they'll be a way that I think people use creativity to find new solutions for.
[00:37:23] Tyson: There's just still so much leftover in the way that we work from like when people used to work in factories. Like even something as like basic as a performance review, like that's like specifically from when people worked in factories, and it no longer works for like the way that we do work. Or even like goal-setting and stuff like that. Like it's so- it's so like pumping out widgets like, you know, like it's just- it's so old school.
[00:37:42] Alexa: Well, just to be clear, some companies literally pump out widgets, right? Like-- [chuckles]
[00:37:46] Tyson: Don't get me wrong. Don't get me wrong.
[00:37:47] Alexa: Yeah.
[00:37:47] Tyson: There's still factories out there.
[00:37:48] Alexa: Yeah.
[00:37:49] Tyson: Like for sure, for sure but--
[00:37:50] Alexa: I-I also think this is like a truly cultural thing too, right? Like,-
[00:37:52] Tyson: Yes.
[00:37:52] Alexa: -we, you know-- This isn't France, we don't shut down for fucking two months in the summer. Like, I'm American, we work all the fucking time. Like we're-we're the hustle porn fucking country, you know, like-
[00:38:02] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:38:02] Alexa: -it just depends.
[00:38:03] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:38:03] Alexa: But that's also why we have some of the biggest, most profitable companies in the world is like, we just don't fucking stop. So I-I think it's a lot of this is cultural. What I actually think that's actually a good prediction I didn't think of, is that I think some of this, the globalization stuff you talked about is going to have a really positive and interesting effect on how-how we do this in general.
One, I think the workforce is just going to be hired more globally because of all this remote shit. I think it's gonna get easier to hire internationally, for sure. I think there's a lot of people incentivized to make that happen. But I also think, you know, you're gonna see a lot of shit like, "Oh, Sweden tried it and it worked." And then it's like, "All right, maybe we should try that, right?" And-and I think that's a good thing, right? Because you need different populations, and different places, and different sort of cultural feedback to like really got test something. And I think we've got the right landscape to do it going forward, which is pretty cool.
[00:38:48] Tyson: Awesome. So lots of big, uh, exciting things to happen in 2022.
[00:38:50] Alexa: Yeah, and I get to talk to you 52 more times.
[00:38:53] Tyson: [laughs]
[00:38:54] Alexa: 51. 51, I guess, 51.
[00:38:56] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:38:57] Alexa: Yeah. So, awesome. I'm looking forward to a big year. We're gonna get some good guests in here. And, uh, obviously if you guys have ideas, predictions, thoughts, comments, feedback, hit us up at firstname.lastname@example.org.
[00:39:08] Tyson: That's so-- [crosstalk]
[00:39:08] Alexa: Uh, that really rolls off the tongue every-every time.
[00:39:11] Tyson: [laughs] Yes. Or at peopleproblemspod-- [crosstalk]
[00:39:12] Alexa: email@example.com. There we go. Well, we have just have to yell at the guy who-
[00:39:16] Tyson: Yeah.
[00:39:16] Alexa: -took people problems. Just keep poking him.
[00:39:18] Tyson: Yeah, seriously.
[00:39:19] Alexa: Just keep poking him, and see how his weird podcast is going. [crosstalk] Yeah. All right, Tyson.
[00:39:23] Tyson: Awesome.
[00:39:24] Alexa: See you next week.
[00:39:25] Tyson: See ya.
[00:39:26] Alexa: This episode was executive produced by me, Alexa Baggio with audio production by Elle Brigida of Clear Harmonies. Our original music was also done by the wonderful Elle Brigida of Clear Harmonies. You can find more information about us and future episodes at peopleproblemspod.com or follow us at people--
[00:39:39] [END OF AUDIO]